The Most Overhyped Tech in BIM Isn't AI with Dhanjeet Sah

Andrea Ciaffi

Hi, Danjit, welcome to the Digital Construction Podcast.

Dhanjeet Sah

Andrea. Thank you, and thanks for inviting me on the podcast. It's my privilege to be a podcaster. Thank you.

Andrea Ciaffi

Today we speak with Danjit Sa. He's the Studio BIM Manager at FK Architects, which is an Australian firm that has built great projects, particularly a famous one is the Eureka Tower.

Andrea Ciaffi

But today I'm very excited to speak with Danjit because when I met him during one of a recent conference in Sydney, I either pushed me to see to see how deep is his knowledge and he has been involved in this industry for a long time or over 27 years.

Andrea Ciaffi

So he has been able to see the transition but from CAD to BIM and now then he's into the transition from BIM to digital engineering and now it's exciting again because we are trying to figure out what's going on with AI. So in the meantime, he has been an instructor, he has been testing different products for Autodesk.

Andrea Ciaffi

So he has really seen the evolution of the industry over a period of time. He is working for different countries, so he has really seen all of the different cycles. And And I think from the different cycles, people have the opportunity, people like Danjit have the opportunity to learn a lot and try to bring this level of obstruction into what's actually happening today.

Andrea Ciaffi

So hopefully, he will help us decrypt what's going on and what happened in the past. But before we start, Danjit, I usually start with the usual question, because I think it's an opportunity for everybody to to share knowledge around career advice and what is the best piece of career advice you have ever received?

Dhanjeet Sah

There are multiples, but I will take three, 12 three. The first advice I learned from one of my ex-boss. And his motto was, make me better to serve you better.

Dhanjeet Sah

Having said that, you know, the people can teach you or give you the correct problem, and then you work it out, or they can teach you, and then you can serve better, so you can serve better around you. And being as a, you know, as a B manager in that company, I realized there's a value and that's why I started learning more.

Dhanjeet Sah

And then I felt like that's how you can serve better in on your community. The second piece of advice was... Shut up, listen, and respond. So when I say shut up, I'm talking about the thoughts, not really just by closing mouth, but it's like thoughts.

Dhanjeet Sah

Shut up, listen, and then respond. So I think I used to react more than responding. And that's where I started changing my, I'm being conscious about that. And that's basically changed my, you know, behavioral pattern as well as it helps me professionally becoming a better Person, as well as a B manager.

Dhanjeet Sah

The third one is about understanding the timing, like to keeping your... value of your time spent on something. Because we understand that we are spending or we are giving a lifetime to someone. So that has to have a particular value. So if I'm spending, let's say, half an hour, that should have a value.

Dhanjeet Sah

So yeah, this piece of advice helped me a lot, helped me a lot in terms of personally as well as professionally.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, that's great. And thinking about your career, I mentioned that you worked in this industry for longer than 27 years. So when you started working in CAD in the late 1990s, what did, can you share with us what the workflow looked like day to day at that time?

Andrea Ciaffi

And How are you using the lessons from those days to then think about Beam today?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, that's a very interesting journey for me. I was still in college where I was learning architecture, studying architecture, and then the computer was coming up, you know, there was like computer boom is coming up, and everybody's looking at what sort of technology we should be using it.

Dhanjeet Sah

And I have no idea about anything about the software or a computer. So I asked one of the professor and he said, AutoCAD. But I heard AutoCAD. I'm like, what's still going to do? So I started searching. Of course, there was There was an internet, but we didn't have much access.

Dhanjeet Sah

I mean, personally, I didn't have an access. So you're just looking at the peers. And then one day I got a chance to speak with one of the person in IT, and he advised me to go for a CAD. So I searched a place where I can learn.

Dhanjeet Sah

OroCAD, and that's where my journey begins. And just after completion of my course, I got a job as an architectural assistant in one of the architectural firms. We are using OroCAD, but there was no one using OroCAD. So I was the first person.

Dhanjeet Sah

I started using OroCAD, and I drafted printed one floor plate, and that was done within a couple of hours, and they were amazed to see the results. And I still remember I printed that in dot matrix printer, which took like a solid, you know, 20 minutes to print a floor plate.

Dhanjeet Sah

Not 20, I think, exaggerating, won't be 5 to 10. So Yeah. So early days was very like people had some ideas how to do it, but it wasn't in the practice. I'm talking in terms of Nepal. And there was big firms, they were using AutoCAD, but the small firms were not using AutoCAD at all.

Dhanjeet Sah

So there was some training provider. So I joined a training provider where I started training people in Nepal. So I've trained more than hundreds of, I mean, few hundreds of people in Nepal and I got opportunity to work in Dubai. So after moving to Dubai, I joined a Autodesk training center where I started training.

Dhanjeet Sah

people on AutoCAD, 3DS Max, and Architects of Desktop. This was a three piece of software. And I could see in Dubai, yeah, most of the architects company, they were using AutoCAD and Revit was not in the picture. Whereas when I moved to Singapore, that's where I picked up Revit.

Dhanjeet Sah

So that's where the beam started evolving, and I can see a good transition from 2D to 3D environment. People started using architectural desktop or Revit, and that's where the beam evolved. And back in 2008, I moved to Australia. And the main reason for moving to Australia was definitely was a BIM platform because I had an expertise and I have a skill set.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I got a work offer from Singap, I mean from Australian company and I moved to Australia. So I was amazed to see Australia has almost like a lot of architects practice were already using Revit and they were in really... I mean, I can see there's a lot of demand in Revit, and that's where I can see it started evolving from BIM.

Dhanjeet Sah

And as we know right now, it's more than BIM in this space.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, that's great. And are there any, you know, like sometimes like the way people used to work in CAD versus the way people work in BIM, and sometimes it's a little bit different. Like I remember back in the days, people working in CAD, maybe they were very precise and maybe they used to pay a lot more attention to details, but maybe that's just my...

Andrea Ciaffi

impression because BIM has made things a little bit easier. But are there any habits or principles that you've learned from your early day in CAD from the CAD era that you still rely on today when you try to deliver a project with BIM or digital engineering?

Dhanjeet Sah

Well, in terms of the design principles, they are still the same. Yeah, the design principles, whether whatever the technology we're going to use, the design principle remains the same. So for example, even if I'm starting a project in AutoCAD, we still need a geolocation.

Dhanjeet Sah

So we need XYZ coordinates and everything is based on the coordinate system. So whether it's a CAD or BIM or next generation, we'll still have the same foundation of using the design.

Dhanjeet Sah

Now, if I relate to how people used to be very specific about CAD because they wanted a precise, which is exactly happening in BIM as well, we are precise, but now the way we work, it changed.

Dhanjeet Sah

So let's say in early days, someone has one mind and one view, or maybe one or two options they can have in CAD, whereas in BIM, we basically use maybe variety of minds or lesser people to integrate all of the ideas to make a better design.

Dhanjeet Sah

So it's a cultural shift. So from one man workmanship from CAD is being transferred to BIM, having more collaborative in design. And then now we can also see the industry the whole ACE industry is embedded within the BIM collaborative environment. So there's definitely a lot of measures saved within how we used to work and how we used to think and how we used to collaborate.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah. And when you think about the transition from BIM, from CAD to BIM to DJ engineering, is there any parts of this that from your point of view went wrong? And is there anything you will do differently now, you will do differently now that based on what you know today?

Dhanjeet Sah

I would say lots, the major changes has been happening in the time. So in the CAD days, we were limited to the tools. So whatever the options they have, we had to basically use it. So your designer perspective or your creativity was compromised within the CAD environments.

Dhanjeet Sah

That's how I look at. So because there was no more tools for the architects to basically enhance their creativity, but they were limited to the tools because of the lack of developments. And of course, having lesser software providers. But now if I look at now, because now it's not just a BIM, but of course, you got a different ways of making your design in reality.

Dhanjeet Sah

in or, of course, with the help of AI, now you can have a different, you know, mix of your design and ideas, and you can get a better product. So, there's a change in expectations as well, is now because becoming more... People are becoming more creative.

Dhanjeet Sah

That's how I look at it, because even me, I'm becoming better because of health of an AI.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, definitely. And when we think about the people that are working in this space, many of them may have the ambition to become BIM leaders or BIM mentors, and maybe they have fantastic technical skills, but there is also, there are also probably other skills that are required to become a BIM mentor.

Andrea Ciaffi

Right, so in your experience, what are the traits or the single trait that separate a brilliant BIM technician from somebody who actually becomes a BIM mentor that can actually grow a team?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, so yeah, if I look at the BIM technician, they could be really good in technical aspect on problem solving, whether it can be on single project or multiple projects. Whereas the mentor means basically you should be able to mentor. Others. So as to become a BIM manager, you should have been in the BIN technician role first of all.

Dhanjeet Sah

That means you are technically perfect, not hardly to say perfect, but you said really good in the technical. And then you should be able to also Train other people so that, without you, they can do their work. So as a BIM mentor, you should be able to transfer your knowledge to others as well, which is a separate skill than being a software specialist for that role.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, it's interesting because sometimes these people probably end up trying to unlearn the great skills that they have, which could be a little bit frustrating if you think about it. You have developed, you spend so much time in your career trying to develop these skills and now

Dhanjeet Sah

Yes.

Andrea Ciaffi

somebody tells you, yeah, but now you have to pass your skills on to others. And also, you're not spending much time on to the tools anymore. Do you think, is there anything else that they need to try to, I don't know, maybe unlearn or relax or give up on?

Dhanjeet Sah

Well, for me, I'm fortunate. Like, I mean, I have unlearned my bad skills. That's how I look at. But the good skills, you still keep it up. And also being a mentor, it does not mean you are losing track of what you used to do.

Dhanjeet Sah

Because you still, even though you have a beam, specialist in your company, you're still looking over on top of it and you should be able to solve the problem they cannot solve. So probably we may not be able to use the tools day by day or every day, but you still have to be on top of it.

Dhanjeet Sah

which is different than what I have in my experience. And now I can say I'm fully utilizing of every knowledge what I have in this my role in this company, which is I think is really matching with what the company requires and what my skill sets are.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I'm using my Let's say, you know, 90 plus percentage of my skills in my workflow at this stage.

Andrea Ciaffi

That's good. And we mentioned before you worked in four different countries. So you worked in Australia, in Singapore, in Dubai, in Nepal. And I always find fascinating to try to

Dhanjeet Sah

Yes.

Andrea Ciaffi

understand if anything changes. Like, is there a different approach to BIM when you work in different countries? Or is it still the same, or what's constant between the different different approaches?

Dhanjeet Sah

Okay, so my timeline when I worked in Nepal, that was back in before, I mean, before 2000. So it was 98 to 2000. That was two years and there was nothing about the BIM. They were just transitioning from drafting board to CAD. That's how my experience is, and then working in Dubai, they were on digital platforms like they're using WhatCAD, ArchiCAD, or...

Dhanjeet Sah

Um... I think architectural desktop, there's three platforms, and of course microassess for other purpose. Now moving to Singapore, that's where the beam started evolving. So I can give some of my experience working with Singapore and Australia, because most of the time I've spent in Australian as a, in my last, 18 years, I have more involved in space at BIM.

Dhanjeet Sah

So at the early days when in Singapore they started BIM, they were very quick to adapt.

Dhanjeet Sah

That's where I realized like a lot of companies, they were on board with BIM and they really wanted to be on board on BIM because the Singapore government was going to make that mandatory for, you know, for a country called the figures, but more than, let's say, $5 million worth of project has to be on BIM, which was not the case in Australia when I moved to Australia.

Dhanjeet Sah

So later, of course, we understand the... architects themselves, they were picking up BIM and they were basically adopting BIM. It's not because of the government mandatory, but because of the efficiency. So in terms of, as I said, the Singapore was fast to adapt because it was making mandatory, whereas Australia was, even if it is not mandatory, they really want to pick up and be more efficiency.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I can see there is a difference in the cultural requirements. So in Singapore, they're more like Has to be done, has to be done, okay, let's do it. But over here in Australia is more on, oh, this is going to make me efficient, less adaptive.

Dhanjeet Sah

So there is a cultural differences. Now, these days, I'm speaking with some of the people in Nepal on the BIM side, and they're gradually progressing with that and I'm glad like I'm involved with one of the organization which is a non-profit organization for BIM where I'm being just an advisor and I can see they are progressively started picking up in their digital transformation.

Andrea Ciaffi

Is there any cultural lesson that you think Australia should learn from other countries? I know you mentioned that Singapore was very quick, but is there anything else that you think should be learned or different countries can learn from each other from your point of view?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, it's hard to answer, to be very honest, because there's a big gap now working with Singapore and there's a huge gap I can say, you know, because from the last 18 years I'm working in Australia and I just worked for four years there.

Dhanjeet Sah

There is definitely a cultural difference in working. Singapore, I can say there was the fast adoption and it's still because it's moron because it's a small country and it's very fast to adapt. So in overall country, you can say, oh yeah, they can.

Dhanjeet Sah

you know, roll out these in, let's say, four years, whereas in Australia it might take 14, for example. So that's the only differences. Whereas Australia is also being innovative, but the scale-wise, there are two different countries. What Australia can learn from Singapore?

Dhanjeet Sah

Well, I think I would be biased if I, if I say something which may not be perfect, but we should learn from Singapore is about the digital adoption and how fast they can they can adopt.

Andrea Ciaffi

Mm. That's great. And you've been testing out this product for two decades now. So you must have seen the evolution of the software and now the software evolved between different releases. Have you noticed any patterns? that in the evolution of the software that you're like, okay, I see, you kind of like feel like you can predict what's going on next.

Andrea Ciaffi

How was your experience in testing these products for others?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, so I started beta testing with Autodesk back in, I think, 2003 or 2004. That's where they started this, called beta testing. And they used to be around, you know, roughly around 400 people around the world when they started. That's my knowledge. And I recall I was doing beta testing for architectural desktop.

Dhanjeet Sah

back in 2003 and there was only hardly 40 people involved around the world. But those days it used to be face-to-face interviews, like, you know, and just... Just using some questionnaire, they used to give us, you know, the option, say, hey, how do you like this feature?

Dhanjeet Sah

This is feature we're going to introduce. And it used to be sometime one-to-one as well. And we used to give feedback on how to do it.

Dhanjeet Sah

And of course, those are exciting for us because being in the industry-leading company, Had to basically be on top of it, so that was a really good interest for me to understand what they are doing and how we can give feedbacks from the customer user base to the company so that they can think of their future ideas.

Dhanjeet Sah

For example, those were the early days and later Autodesk. came up with ideas, something called ideas for particular products. So they have called Revit ideas, OrCAD ideas, and for every product now they have, which is a platform where anybody can simply go and post what they want to see in the next few releases.

Dhanjeet Sah

So let's say in the simple terms, like you used to be a big voice for me. We used to be a big voice for the tester, but now there are majority of people that can be involved in that, which is open source right now.

Dhanjeet Sah

To be honest, like I'm not doing beta testing much right now. these days because it's, I can say we have limited times for sure. So yeah, I have seen the majority I can, in my experience, yeah, they used to align with the user database, but again, it's up to Autodesk how they have.

Dhanjeet Sah

time it in the past, which sometimes used to be, I used to be happy, but not much. I mean, these days, it's more like we are more on what do you call the problem solving by ourselves. So we do solve our problems and we have to move on.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I'm not personally focused on ideas these days.

Andrea Ciaffi

Mm. Would you recommend to anyone starting in this industry to participate into these initiatives as a beta testing, or do you think that the format is not as exciting anymore? So it's probably, I don't want to say a waste of time, but maybe not the best way to spend time.

Dhanjeet Sah

No, absolutely. Look, I mean, as I said, like, I am unable to do that. It's because of my personal time. But as I said, like, if someone is interested and want to learn, definitely that's a really good platform. Autodesk has those IDL support, and also they can sign in for beta testing.

Dhanjeet Sah

And I believe like if you are a user, you can basically join the beta testing. So they have some qualification criteria, I'm pretty sure. And once they are qualified, they allow you to basically download the beta version. And then in that platform, you can start posting once you do the testing and say, this is going to, it's not working or you can send a feedback.

Dhanjeet Sah

So they have set up a really good mechanism on the feedback sessions. So I definitely recommend if someone wants to be part of the beta testing, yes, please go ahead.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, nice. And thinking about the people who work in this industry, I often think about all of the tools that we create internally within the businesses, because maybe because certain things are missing, for example.

Andrea Ciaffi

And you have seen so many features, but when you look back and you think about all the features that you've been testing all the features, and maybe you thought was a good idea to build. Is there anything that you think, oh, they should have built this, but they haven't done it yet?

Andrea Ciaffi

Is there anything you can think of today?

Dhanjeet Sah

There are, there are many of them. Okay, so this is in my view, okay? This is in my experience, okay? I can't cover the others' view, but I'm just covering in my view, in my experience. When I used to be, let's say 10 years ago, I did not know much about what is required in the markets.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I was happy what I was happy with what, you know, I'm getting. But when you started really working in the industry and with a top class company, you realize the requirements are different. So when you started learning the requirements and different and the software doesn't match your requirement.

Dhanjeet Sah

So what are you looking at is the workarounds, right? So, and this is where when you say workaround, you started looking at different tools, different technologies, and then you started thinking of, okay, I'm going to develop my own plugin and then start working because there actual software does not work.

Dhanjeet Sah

So there's a variety of areas I can think of, like, you know, there's a lot of things is there built in the tools, which we hardly use it. because your workflow is different. So every company, and that's where these days, even at FK, we develop our own tools, internal tools, to make things more productive and better.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah. And in your journey, you've seen many technologies emerge. I don't want to list them all, but you know, like there is virtual reality, augmented reality, drones, and now there is AI, the beam itself. Like there are so many things that emerged. And When you think about these technologies, is there...

Andrea Ciaffi

Which one, from your point of view, are the most overhyped over time that then basically didn't deliver much value versus the ones that have actually maybe quietly transformed the industry while everybody else was distracted thinking about the more louder? technologies.

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, as a overhyped, I would say digital twin. So... I was, I think I attended one of the sessions back in 2012 or 2013. And that's where they started talking about digital twin. And I look at technology trend and they were saying within 5 to 10 years, it will be, you know, overtaking the beam.

Dhanjeet Sah

It never happened. So there is, there is still talks going on about digital twin, but in reality, it may have worked in the manufacturing space, but I'm unsure if there are big success in architectural or in a in a operating, building operating environment, how successful they are.

Dhanjeet Sah

I haven't seen personally as a best user use cases. So still there are works going on, but I think it didn't deliver what they were supposed to deliver in five to. you know, seven years of time, which is over now, you know, 15 years now, they've been talking about.

Dhanjeet Sah

Now, if I look at something which was not a big thing, we have talked in the past, but it slowly progressed, what is that is the common data environment. So there was lesser, you know, talks going on about CDE, but gradually it's now becoming the cultural shift in how we work.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I think these two technologies are, one is overhyped, what I can say It was underrated, but it's become one of the successful technologies.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, the digital twin, you're right. It's an interesting one because it feels like the entire industry have been talking about all the time. Yeah, it didn't really deliver what expected in construction.

Andrea Ciaffi

And then when you think about when you think about new technology, right, so it's one of the challenges is to decide should I really invest my time and energy to pay attention to this, or I should just politely be curious about this. How do you personally evaluate a new tool or technology to decide, yes, okay, I want to invest my time in this?

Andrea Ciaffi

Or maybe this is another digital twin.

Dhanjeet Sah

At this stage, I think the AI makes lots easier to gather some of the feedbacks if you want to invest on time on something. So the before AI, the good source was for me was LinkedIn, having a good connection in LinkedIn. You see the updates, you see the announcements.

Dhanjeet Sah

But of course, you have your own intelligence as a human to pick up which can be overhyped, yes or no. And then based on your experience and based on your profession, you can pick the tools, right? So as before, let's say, pre-AI days, I used to definitely look at the LinkedIn feedbacks and download a trial test versus what is required for the company.

Dhanjeet Sah

And if it is not going to save any time, you're spending more time, say no to that. That's a very simple answer. But I think thanks to AI these days, you can pick up others. other people's experience, right? And then you can see and you can get some overview and then you can make a better decision.

Andrea Ciaffi

Certainly a great aggregator of data. And you touched this, you mentioned AI. It's the elephant in the room. Where do you think AI sits at the moment in the current hype cycle? Are we all living a dream or is this something that will be a real thing for you.

Dhanjeet Sah

Well, I had an impression that is overhyped.

Andrea Ciaffi

Mm.

Dhanjeet Sah

Maybe it could have overhived when they're saying the job will be lost. Now, there won't be any, you know, less creativity or sort of things. But I look at the AI in a positive way, because it still enhances your skills and gives you better idea.

Dhanjeet Sah

something which we can never think of. It could have sometime I understand there's a lot of information spitted from them and it's hard to digest from AI. So I think it is more on how do I use the AI efficiently would be understanding of the prompt.

Dhanjeet Sah

So the more clarity I give you to AI, the better answer I can receive. So it's more on the prompt side, I can say. And I see the AI, I look at the way I want to use it rather than what's there. Right?

Dhanjeet Sah

So for example, if I'm looking at a particular task and say, hey, I'm just looking at an option. Can you give me 5 different options to that? And I get a 5 different answer, which I can never think of.

Dhanjeet Sah

So I still see it's valuable, but if I say it may have overhyped, if it is looking at the investing, like, you know, in the investment industry, it may have overhyped, but in reality, like if I'm paying something for a subscription, let's say, You know, twenty-four dollars a month, I think it's still valid.

Andrea Ciaffi

And do you see any value in how AI can help? The people working like BIM workflows, do you see there is any value in that or it's just like what we see in Chad GDP, you ask what you just mentioned, right? So you ask a question, you give me 5 options, is there actually value today that you can see in the BIM workflows?

Dhanjeet Sah

Well, absolutely. There are lots of values. There are lots of values for not just in the BIM management, but we are using AI in the design presentations. And also, if we have to run any metrics for, you know, apartment configurations, we give them.

Dhanjeet Sah

the scenarios or the rules, set of rules, and they give us some options very fast, like it can work it out in, you know, seconds or sometimes minutes, which will take, you know, hours to do that, someone to do that. So definitely there's a value of it.

Dhanjeet Sah

Now, in terms of B management, I see And we are using it basically, we have something called our own agent called Beam Execution Plan Reviewer, right? So actually, some other companies send us the BEP, so we can simply review BEP. compared to ours and say, where are the, you know, the risk factors?

Dhanjeet Sah

What are the differences between two? Which I've got a quick review, which might take for me to an hour or two to just go through that and a human can make errors, right? The AI can give you slightly better. ideas on that and also flag you the risk which I may have not picked it up.

Dhanjeet Sah

So just to ensure, but as I said, I am not relying 100% of AI at all. It's all about having a second secondary opinions and see which one can be valid or which can be invalid. And you are the human, you have your own intelligence.

Dhanjeet Sah

and you can pick it up the right options for you. Now, so that's about the BEP reviews. I also, sometimes if I get a question, I ask myself, do I know well? The answer is no. I do not know everything. So for example, I give a simple example.

Dhanjeet Sah

Let's say, what are the best practices for grouping in Revit. I know 8 answers, but there are missing 2 answers. And who can answer me? AI. So it makes sense. Like for me, I grade myself, like I know some, but I know, you know, I do not know everything.

Dhanjeet Sah

So there should be somewhere you can get answers from and AI can simply answer you some, you know. So if I got it right and there are two was missing, I can understand this too, which is again adding value to my knowledge skills.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah, and and do you think do you think this is? going to stay the same or do you think it's going to change in the future? I'm just wondering if you, of course it's hard to predict, right?

Andrea Ciaffi

Because we don't know where the evolution of AI will go, but do you feel like there will be some parts of the workflow that will still remain human and some part that will probably be just completely absorbed by AI?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, in my perspective, in my the. Some the the manual work is still we do as a BIM manager will be gone. Example would be the BIM coordinates and class detection. Those are all will be minimized. I won't say to be be gone if it'll still we need human interaction.

Dhanjeet Sah

To validate and approve, but at the same time, those things will be gone from the list. The review parts, for example, the creating BIM execution plan, reviewing BIM execution plan, these are all can be automated, so you just need to basically read through, and then you just need...

Dhanjeet Sah

To sign it, that's how we look at those things will be gone. I can also see the tools are becoming better in documentation, so when we're doing documentation, we spend a lot of time documenting using a particular software where those... will start automating in terms of it's not will be fully automated, but it will be still semi-automated, so you're saving a lot of time.

Dhanjeet Sah

And what is still will be relevant to a BIM manager, definitely it's all about the making. decisions and to be able to make better decision, you still need that. The human consciousness will never, you know, stop, right? So we have to be on top of even AI will answer for us.

Andrea Ciaffi

Yeah. And when you think about a new BIM manager or somebody starting to prepare now to become a BIM manager, they probably need to prepare, of course, technically, but also intellectually on how to lead a team in this AI augmented production environment. What type of advice would you give to this person?

Andrea Ciaffi

Time to navigate this new space.

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, that will be a question for me as well. What's next in next, you know, next 10 years that will define how we should be starting? Definitely, I can see it has taken, let's say, you know, 10 years for me to experience the Tools and technology, they might get, you know, get in three to four years' time.

Dhanjeet Sah

However, because experience cannot be replaced by technologies for sure. Yeah. So still, they need to go through the experience, but of course, they will get information easily and they can get a better answer. So they do not need to spend 10 years to become someone who has 10 years of experience in BIM.

Dhanjeet Sah

They might get those learnings in one to two years time, and they can be better in the next 10 years.

Andrea Ciaffi

Danjit, sorry. Danjit, we are at the end of this episode. This was great. If people want to reach out to you, where can they find you?

Dhanjeet Sah

Yeah, the easiest way is to connect me, please connect me on LinkedIn, which I can provide the link to the podcast and also I may provide the email address. Thank you.

Andrea Ciaffi

Perfect. Thank you, Danjit. It was great to speak to you today. Thank you for joining us on the Digital Construction Podcast.

Dhanjeet Sah

Thank you so much. Thank you, Andrea. It was a great place and it was really interesting meeting with you and look forward for to meet you sometime soon.